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#Ottawa friends, any recommendations/experiences with Solar+Battery installs? Helping my folks out with deciding between a natural gas type system as opposed to a Solar+battery backup system (Which can use the federal Credit)

Also not sure from the website if you can do the 1k/kWh up to 5k rebate/grant and also do the up to 1k in batteries grant

(I think no, but unsure, meaning up to 4K for solar, 1k for battery/inverter etc. )

https://natural-resources.canada.ca/energy-efficiency/homes/canada-greener-homes-grant/start-your-energy-efficient-retrofits/plan-document-and-complete-your-home-retrofits/eligible-grants-for-my-home-retrofit/23504#s6

in reply to FCLC

My understanding of the grant for batteries is that:

1) it must be connected to a solar system, so batteries by themselves don’t count
2) you can get up to $1000 per kW of solar, plus up to $1000 for batteries, but the total amount is still capped at $5000 for all items in the grant (batteries, solar, other stuff like water heaters or insulation, etc.)

So in your case, $4k for solar + $1k for batteries, not $5k for solar + $1k for batteries (unfortunately)

This entry was edited (1 year ago)
in reply to Andrew Dunham

that sounds like a good deal. Our new solar panels here actually came from Canada.
in reply to Alan Sill

Slight problem is that it's Canadian monopoly money, so lop ~25% off the top for USD equivalent. 😅

They have a 100A panel as things stand, but either way it's going to need some sort of retrofit, be it generator or solar

in reply to FCLC

Pretty simple algorithm. 1) Determine the difference in real estate value in your area for homes w/solar compared to without. In our area the resale value typically goes up by about the cost of the panels. In some areas it's actually more for some reason! In some areas, less, so check your area. 2) Calculate electricity usage for each month of the year over the past few years if you can. Most solar installers have access to sophisticated modeling. Use that for 3) Estimate savings.
in reply to Alan Sill

In our case the net cost given home value appreciation will be zero or better once we move out and sell, and we got a 30% tax rebate, with which the time to recover the cost of the system even ignoring resale value appreciation is abut 10 years. That's with nominal average numbers -- this summer has been well above average. We've saved ~$500 US in electricity costs in ~2.5 months so far since putting them in, and avoided generating about 4 tons of carbon emissions in our area.
This entry was edited (1 year ago)
in reply to FCLC

OOC, are they primarily looking for "a backup when the power is out", or "save money on their power bill", both, or something else?
in reply to Andrew Dunham

Most home solar systems without batteries, and many with them, are so-called "grid-connected" meaning grid power has to be on for them to work. (Simple reason is electricity has to have some place to go when generated!) Some systems with batteries are designed to allow batteries to be used if grid is off, but not all. Check this explicitly with each provider. In our case we went without a battery because cost-effectiveness is not as good and technology is still changing, but YMMV.
in reply to Alan Sill

Yeah, here the problem that I'm helping them solve is the question of "when we get a tornado in July, hail/ice storm in August or blizzard in January, how do we still power the home?"

So all in one NG generator is appealing as all weather "always works" solution.

Alternative is a battery backup system, but that's not self sufficient unless you add Solar generation of some sort.

in reply to FCLC

in reply to Andrew Dunham

I more or less agree, but I'm not letting anything that burns fossil fuel come in as a new purchase to my house or (most likely) garage and battery technology is getting better quickly with time. In our case we went with solar now for cost and climate change reasons and will probably add the battery in 2-3 years as costs are coming down rapidly there too. We decided that we didn't need to make all of the improvements at once in order to reap benefits and help w/ change.
in reply to Andrew Dunham

1/2 Whilst I'm continuing to dig, something I noticed is that Enbridge has a program that works in tandem with the federal Greener Homes Grant up to 10K.

They retain the 5K max on solar, 1K per kW limit, but it looks like it decouples the "up to 1K" on batteries.

main page: https://www.enbridgegas.com/residential/rebates-energy-conservation/home-efficiency-rebate-plus#section_2

T&Cs: https://www.enbridgegas.com/residential/rebates-energy-conservation/~/link.aspx?_id=38C3A680BDCC430585711C147EDBBBF5&_z=z

I think you could feasibly do 5k grants in solar, 1k in battery infra, then be on the hook for: [continues in next toot]

in reply to FCLC

2/2
The cost difference in 5kW of solar and the 5kW grant (Any rough idea on what the real world cost/kW of solar installed is including labour and infrastructure?)

From there, out of pocket for a few grant worth of batteries?

"direct comparables" AKA the NG generator they're looking at is a Honeywell 22KW NG unit

generator + transfer switch is ~7k (costco honeywell 22kW model, unit here: https://www.honeywellstore.com/store/products/wifi-22kw-home-stand-by-generator-70652.htm) + labour and other fees

in reply to FCLC

Depends a lot on your area. Best bet is to get many quotes and compare them. The out of pocket cost will certainly be higher for solar but it will continue to save money, which the generator certainly won’t. You will also need to start the generator periodically and maintain it. Essentially zero maintenance for photovoltaic panels, est lifetime 25 years compared with likely 10 years for battery and maybe a bit more than that (15?) for a generator.
This entry was edited (1 year ago)
in reply to Alan Sill

Both generators and batteries need adequate attention to siting, ventilation, and safety. Apart from proper mounting and electrical installation topics there are no significant safety issues with panels AFAICT. Batteries don’t like being very hot or cold but development for automotive use has greatly helped to extend those limits. They emit heat when discharging so need adequate ventilation for cooling. Generators need to be away from buildings and people.

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