Free healthcare doesn't usually scale well and doesn't work for large, first-world nations. And doctors should be paid for their expertise, so I don't think that healthcare should be free. However, healthcare should be affordable for everyone.
As in most countries? Because most countries are generally pretty small.
I'm talking about countries the size of the #USA, #Canada, #Russia, #China, etc.
It works really well on a small scale, which is why you see it in smaller countries like those in #Europe. A reasonable case could probably be made to try universal healthcare at a state level since the scale is probably pretty similar for most American states.
Corruption doesn't help, sure, and that's kinda what you get with monopolies after awhile, both in the private and public sectors. If you removed the corruption, the #NHS would have been fine.
@lispi314 @icedquinn So your point is that if only we had free healthcare, we'd have a quality of care on par with... #Canada? #Russia? Are you saying that the healthcare is better in these countries? 🤔
allowing people to die from afflictions we can cure but don't because they cant "Afford" care is just fucking atrocious, it is one of the most heinous detestable thing I cant even imagine.
Like its disgusting and the people who support it are disgusting.
The people who support private healthcare are... without any minced words Pure Fucking Evil. There is no fucking redeeming these fuckers. They are fucked in the head beyond sanity.
The level of callousness borders on psychopathy. These people lack any sense of empathy and I think we should refuse them any empathy. Fuck these people.
This is saying "I value corporate profits over peoples lives" in the most direct way possible. "Poor sick people SHOULD die for being poor and sick."
They can dress it up however they want but it is a MONSTROUS position to take.
> The people who support private healthcare are... without any minced words Pure Fucking Evil.
Well, okay then. 😂 I suspect that my chance of having a good faith conversation with you about this is quite limited if that is your genuine position.
I can do my best but like... there was no room for a good faith argument on this topic because its a solved problem with data backing it. it would be like having a good faith debate as to why 2 + 2 should = 5.
And thats before taking in any ethical or humanist considerations.
You're right as a secular humanist I find it as abhorrent as stoning women to death for being 'impure'.
Obviously a conversation can be had about it but there is no changing my mind about it being wrong on a fundamental level and it is a stain on every nation that practices it.
They might as well gather people together a put guns to their heads and blow their brains out if they don't hand over all of their money. It is legalized extortion.
The unavoidable problem is that healthcare requires people to work, input from workers, and so anyone stating that healthcare should be free runs into the issue of requiring people to work without compensation.
It runs into the issue of you’re going to fix me for free. You’re going to work for me for free.
@volkris While that's a good point, to be fair that's not necessarily how universal healthcare works in most countries.
People saying that universal healthcare is free is lying, it costs citizens in taxes. Many if not most places that have universal healthcare have higher taxes as a result.
This year, Canadian patients faced a median wait of 27.7 weeks for medically necessary treatment from a specialist after being referred by a general practitioner.
Mallory's Musings & Mischief
in reply to 💜 AdoraBeryl 🩷 • • •casey is remote
in reply to 💜 AdoraBeryl 🩷 • • •Wait aren't most non-profit hospitals like #Catholic or something?
> Every day, more than one in seven patients in the U.S. is cared for in a Catholic hospital.
https://www.chausa.org/about/about/facts-statistics
Facts - Statistics
www.chausa.org💜 AdoraBeryl 🩷
in reply to casey is remote • • •casey is remote
in reply to 💜 AdoraBeryl 🩷 • • •ðŸ’œ AdoraBeryl 🩷
in reply to casey is remote • • •casey is remote
in reply to 💜 AdoraBeryl 🩷 • • •As in most countries? Because most countries are generally pretty small.
I'm talking about countries the size of the #USA, #Canada, #Russia, #China, etc.
It works really well on a small scale, which is why you see it in smaller countries like those in #Europe. A reasonable case could probably be made to try universal healthcare at a state level since the scale is probably pretty similar for most American states.
💜 AdoraBeryl 🩷
in reply to casey is remote • • •thats not a problem with size its a problem with corruption.
Look at the NHS it didn't get massively worse because the UK got bigger it got worse because the government got way more corrupt.
casey is remote
in reply to 💜 AdoraBeryl 🩷 • • •LisPi
in reply to casey is remote • • •You realize that Canada and Russia's populations are pretty insignificant in comparison to most of those other "smaller" countries?
Incidentally, /despite/ all the corruption and incompetence, they still both have national healthcare.
Q.U.I.N.N.
in reply to LisPi • • •How Government Solved
www.freenation.orgLisPi
in reply to Q.U.I.N.N. • • •casey is remote
in reply to LisPi • • •LisPi
in reply to casey is remote • • •No, my point is how /easy/ it is to have it if those two fuckup nations manage to have it (actual quality depends on a lot of internal factors).
And no matter how bad it can get, I probably don't need to remind you, it is always better than /literally nothing/ because one cannot afford it.
💜 AdoraBeryl 🩷
in reply to LisPi • • •allowing people to die from afflictions we can cure but don't because they cant "Afford" care is just fucking atrocious, it is one of the most heinous detestable thing I cant even imagine.
Like its disgusting and the people who support it are disgusting.
The people who support private healthcare are... without any minced words Pure Fucking Evil. There is no fucking redeeming these fuckers. They are fucked in the head beyond sanity.
The level of callousness borders on psychopathy. These people lack any sense of empathy and I think we should refuse them any empathy. Fuck these people.
This is saying "I value corporate profits over peoples lives" in the most direct way possible. "Poor sick people SHOULD die for being poor and sick."
They can dress it up however they want but it is a MONSTROUS position to take.
There is no fucking nuance on that point either.
Vile Fucking Monsters. Endof.
No debate with them is worth having.
casey is remote
in reply to 💜 AdoraBeryl 🩷 • • •@lispi314 @icedquinn
> The people who support private healthcare are... without any minced words Pure Fucking Evil.
Well, okay then. 😂 I suspect that my chance of having a good faith conversation with you about this is quite limited if that is your genuine position.
💜 AdoraBeryl 🩷
in reply to casey is remote • • •I can do my best but like... there was no room for a good faith argument on this topic because its a solved problem with data backing it. it would be like having a good faith debate as to why 2 + 2 should = 5.
And thats before taking in any ethical or humanist considerations.
You're right as a secular humanist I find it as abhorrent as stoning women to death for being 'impure'.
Obviously a conversation can be had about it but there is no changing my mind about it being wrong on a fundamental level and it is a stain on every nation that practices it.
They might as well gather people together a put guns to their heads and blow their brains out if they don't hand over all of their money. It is legalized extortion.
volkris
in reply to 💜 AdoraBeryl 🩷 • • •The unavoidable problem is that healthcare requires people to work, input from workers, and so anyone stating that healthcare should be free runs into the issue of requiring people to work without compensation.
It runs into the issue of you’re going to fix me for free. You’re going to work for me for free.
You see how problematic that is?
@realcaseyrollins
casey is remote
in reply to volkris • • •@volkris While that's a good point, to be fair that's not necessarily how universal healthcare works in most countries.
People saying that universal healthcare is free is lying, it costs citizens in taxes. Many if not most places that have universal healthcare have higher taxes as a result.
💜 AdoraBeryl 🩷
in reply to casey is remote • • •casey is remote
in reply to 💜 AdoraBeryl 🩷 • • •@volkris
> when they need it
https://efpia.eu/news-events/the-efpia-view/efpia-news/new-data-from-efpia-reveals-multiple-factors-leading-to-unequal-access-to-medicines-for-patients-across-europe/
https://www.mpamag.com/au/news/general/most-australians-delay-healthcare-due-to-high-costs/487886
https://archive.is/sS0y3
https://www.forbes.com/sites/sallypipes/2023/12/26/canadian-health-care-leaves-patients-frozen-in-line/
Canadian Health Care Leaves Patients Frozen In Line
Sally Pipes (Forbes)